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Post by CRMichaelis on Mar 23, 2008 14:16:22 GMT -8
I have one of Schipper's M1907 Greatcoats and had a couple of questions, Herr Wolf... I assume the coat should have the red collar patches for infantry. Also, early-war, say August 1914, they would have had the corps' piping and regimental numbers embroidered on the shoulder straps, correct?
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Post by hwolf on Mar 29, 2008 15:42:26 GMT -8
Chris,
Ok I did some research on this. Theoretically you are correct on all accounts BUT I would not put anything on. Heres why....As early as 1908 during the annual war games, the Prussian War Ministry considered deleting the insignia of the Greatcoat all together. Once trench warfare began, just like anything else, the greatcoat lost its obvious insignia. In early 1915 all bright and noticeable insignia was ordered removed (as well as the order to blacken all leather gear.) All shoulder boards were ordered to be with out piping at this time as well. It would appear that the insignia regulations were enforced and followed while the leather one was not (probably because of the ease in ripping things off with a pocket knife compared to dying things. ) Anyhow...I digress, since we normally do a late war impression, I'd say leave the insignia off enitrely. There is plenty of photos showing soldats with no shoulder boards. If we do an Early War event, put the insignia on.
I hope this helps.
Dan
"wolf"
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Post by CRMichaelis on Mar 31, 2008 21:57:06 GMT -8
Thanks Dan,
I appreciate you getting back to me and for doing the homework. I am interested in doing this one up as an early-war impression to go with my pickelhaube and M1907/10 tunic.
Thanks much,
Chris
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Post by CRMichaelis on May 15, 2008 20:48:30 GMT -8
Okay, a primer on German greatcoats. I understand the M1915 model in general, but have a question regarding color - it should be feldgrau, right? At least according to Mike Gonzales' great little Echtheitsbuch fur JR23 it should be. GWM offers theirs in feldgrau, Schipper's is steingrau. Then there are the pre-war and M1907 models... According to Herr Gonzales, the pre-war coat "had straight tube sleeves, and a smaller collar than later issues, the collar secured together by means of a hook and eye. The buttons were of the pre-war smooth TOMBAK type and were spaced further apart than later coats, and closer to the seam of the coat panel. The back panel of the garment was one piece without pleats... this version was manufactured in a light mouse gray wool as well as in stone gray wool." The Model 1907 greatcoat "had a larger collar" with pointed ends. The buttons were closer together and were either the pre-war TOMBAK version or brass tunic buttons. "The cuffs of the sleeves were now turned back in the 'French cuff' style... The back panel features a large gusset ... extending from beneath the collar to the adjustment belt." "The back rear of all the greatcoat variations were vented, these vents could be buttoned closed... The M1907 greatcoat was manufactured in stone gray, however some field gray examples survive today." The M1907 greatcoat I have from Schipper has: tube sleeves (pre-war); mouse gray wool (pw); smooth brass buttons painted gray (?); back panel gusset (M1907); small, rounded collar (pw); and no buttons on the vent (?). I know there were variations and exceptions to all regs, but is what Schipper is calling a M1907 a reasonable variation or  I have not seen one of the late Ken Boice's German greatcoats, but from the description on his website, it appears that Schipper might have copied Boice's pattern. This would lend credibility to Schipper's coats as I've heard nothing but good things about Boice's authenticity. Any thoughts? The coat is very well made from high quality wool. It's just the more I read about German overcoats the more questions I have. And this is not intended to be a slam on Schipper - I'm just trying to figure out what coat I have based on my reference materials. |
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Post by Marcus on Jan 7, 2010 15:34:37 GMT -8
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Post by hanskc on Jan 10, 2010 19:24:44 GMT -8
According to several sources, including Johan Somers' Imperial German Uniforms and Equipment 1907-1918, they should be field grey. The Mantel went through several changes in the early part of the war. By early 1915, they started making them in field grey. In late 1915, the new model was officially released, made of field grey material with the reseda green collar. I have seen no source or originals that indicate the 1915 model being made in stone grey.
John
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Post by CRMichaelis on Sept 7, 2010 20:07:41 GMT -8
Marcus, The M1915 mantel was only in feldgrau as pointed out from what I've found. The earlier versions were various shades of "mouse-gray" or steingrau. I just noticed that Hessen is offering M1915 overcoats for $180! Can't vouch for them as I haven't seen even a picture yet, but worth looking into! The post is hard to find - it's under Uniforms, then Uniform Accessories.
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Post by Marcus on Sept 8, 2010 10:55:53 GMT -8
I've been watching that page for a while to see a photo. I converted a WW2 coat already though.
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I have not seen one of the late Ken Boice's German greatcoats, but from the description on his website, it appears that Schipper might have copied Boice's pattern. This would lend credibility to Schipper's coats as I've heard nothing but good things about Boice's authenticity.
