WARHORSE-(WARNING SPOILERS!!!)

[hwolf]

You have to see the movie to see the chest armor. I know the Germans had trench armor which was used in VERY limited numbers because of the weight etc. Did the Brits have something like that? It struck me as wrong.

[aefstraggler]

Yes - the British did try several different types of armor /body shields.

One type was the Dayfield shield (also referred to as a protective waistcoat) - consisting of
several metal plates that were sewn into a harness (protecting both front and back).

Another was the Chemico shield - which was made from layers of different fabrics bonded
with a resin.

And there were other types - one being a series of 2 inch square plates - tied together, slightly
overlapping.

No idea however on how heavy or effective (or common) any of them were.

[hwolf]

Thats what I thought. The one one depicted in the movie looked like a medieval breast plate front and back. Another type in the movie was just a front plate. mI thought both was Farb.
Dan

[1886lebel]

Many countries tried armor plating, France, Italy, etc. 90% of these were discarded as useless items.
Look at the French Cuirassiers, they were still wearing Breast Plates well into the mid 1940's into combat, after WWII it became Ceremonial Use. If you look at the Presidental Guards in Paris they are still wearing pre-WWI uniforms and equipment from the Third Republic.

Patrick

[1886lebel]

I just saw the movie ... it was GOOD, I will get it for my library of WWI movies when it comes out on DVD.
BTW: The tank did have Lewis Guns in it, right behing the Naval 6 inch Guns, they encased in the correct sleeves used in the Male and Female Tanks

Patrick

[hwolf]

Ahhhh...I missed that. But since I warned you...you knew what to look for ;D
Dan

[1886lebel]

One of the British soldiers in the movie reminded me of a certain LOVEABLE RSM we all know, he looked like him and that bloody accent sounded like him as well .... I wonder if it was his TWIN LOL ;D

[muddhen]

saw the movie tonight, photography was good, sound effects were good trench scenes were good, story was a little far fetched.............well, alot far fetched,i as well noticed the lewis guns,although it was hard to see them on a tank that was running 20 mph down what appeared to be a 20 foot wide trench with no people around anywhere, of course i might have missed them when the horse climbed over the top of the tank and jumped off the back. i am still wondering how the two horses climb the stairs and hid in the attic.

on a side note, the movie does have one of the smartest geese i've ever seen

[1886lebel]

I LOVED that GOOSE, he was well trained, plus they are very smart anyways. I used to have one, he was very protective of his yard and always let you know when someone came around into his domain.

Patrick

[oskar2ndchev]

OK, finally saw it. Here's a few of my impressions:

1) Story- Well, it's fiction so you have to suspend disbelief so roll with it. ;D

2) British cavalry charge- Excellent! It's great to see that much horseflesh stirrup-to-stirrup. Having done a few of these on a smaller scale, it definitely get's the blood pumping.

3) The whole "hit the German camp" scene just didn't make any sense from a historical or military viewpoint. Ever hear of pickets and skirmish lines? Or even some sentries keeping watch? Even in the fluid conditions of August 1914, units were always on the alert- you know, it's part of what's called tactical doctrine. Also, if it's August 1914 and the Germans are going all-out (you know, swing in an arc towards Paris per Schlieffen Plan and all that), you're not going to have a camp with people lounging around during the day- most likely, they're all going to be on the move. Finally, the machinegun deployment was lame and made no tactical sense. There's some reference to it all being an "ambush" but even that is pretty lame for an explanation. OK, and where were the zeltbahns? Must have gotten a deal on Civil War era wall tents. OK, I could go on.

4) Related to #3. In 1914, British cavalry was issued the lance as their main mounted weapon. I saw no lances...swords look more cool in a charge but lances is what they had for mounted work.

5) Trench scenes later in 1918 were excellent- for some reason, it just had "Seph" written all over them. I was expecting him to pop out around a corner at anytime. Definitely gives you a good idea of how these went. I question the whole "Somme 1918" thing but I'll let it pass.

6) The tank scene- OK, pretty cool in a John Woo can of way for the horse to make his escape BUT tanks would have been working together with infantry and probably going forward along with everyone else (unless of course, you're that idiot General Harper of the 51st Highland Division).

7) The whole scene when Joey the horse winds up at the aid station. No, you don't put the horse down- you send it to the vet section. Yes, the British Army was well-equipped with veterinary hospitals. Also, since horses were considered Crown property, it wasn't the doctor's call to make. OK, it's a movie.

8) The Germans are made out to be mostly stupid and clueless. Right. OK, the two kids who desert- they'd probably be given some sort of drum-head court martial and then shot. Maybe. Or at least sent to a penal battalion. Also, I seriously doubt if the unit they belong to is going to be tearing up the countryside looking for them. The Feld Gendarmerie, on the other hand, was a different matter.

9) Related to #8 above, any horses captured would have been sent to the rear. If they couldn't draw wagons/artillery, they would have been retrained. There were specialists for this sort of thing- horses are too valuable to just shoot. Plus, I can guarantee that some officer would have snagged one of the captured officer's horses for their own- too good a thing to pass up.

10) This is mostly for the horse folks- Before you hitch up a horse to a wagon, plough or caisson, you have to TRAIN the horse. For that matter, you have to train a horse for any useful work and especially for cavalry charges. It just doesn't "happen" and "reasoning" with the horse doesn't work (trust me, I've tried ;D).

11) Probably the worst flaw is that the passing of time is not clear at all- one moment it's August 1914...then it's sometime 1916 or beyond when everyone's got stahlhelms...then it's 1918...just didn't work well to advance the story.

OK, not the greatest movie but I'll probably buy the DVD. But at heart, it's a work of fiction. You want strict accuracy? You'll never get it in a movie so keep reading those first-person accounts and looking at original pictures. The rest, you're mind will have to supply.

P.S. The goose was excellent and yes, they can be pretty aggressive- we used them to guard nuclear munitions dumps in Germany back in the 1980s. ;D

[1886lebel]

The big problem with HOLLYWOOD is that they make any Germans seem like they are NAZI's in any movie, they were rough, aggressive, etc., etc. and they tend to forget that this was pre-Nazi times, they want them all to be the BAD GUYS to BOOO at.
The same thing happened at our last event with the captured Germans we had, thinking I was going to take the prisoner back to shoot him, even though he was correct in thinking that as he had seen his fellow compatriots bieng shot as they surrendered to the Allies that captured them.
WE DO NOT SHOT PRISONERS EVER, once thier hands are UP in the Air they are no longer combatitive forces and to be taken to the rear. My rule as Allied Brigade Commander, we treat them with respect and as prisoners of war, we take thier weapons, search them for documents, treat thier wounds, give them something to drink or eat if they want it and get thier information to pass along to the proper authorities to the rear. I am sure they will do the same for us if we get captured.

As to the movie, I read the review prior to going to it but I went to it open minded without really taking in the historical accuracies of things that were wrong, it made the movie watching bearable and as a story it was heart-warming one.
The Cavalry Charge was AWESOME, I kept thinking to myself during it was ... I bet Adam would have LOVED to be doing this charge with Max
The yelling British Sgt in the trenches reminded me of Seph, the German who took care of the horses reminded me of Sean, the Piper definetely of Micheal and the Indian Sgt. Major of Alvaro when he did that impression at Ft. MacArthur in 2010
The French poilu's at the auction near the end of the movie were are a nice touch to see though.

Patrick

[Marcus]

I took the family to watch it yesterday. It worked out for all of us. Obviously I was there for the WWI part and my daughter is a hunter jumper so she is a horse fanatic so it was nice to bring both our worlds together.

From the time I saw the first t trailer I knew it was going to something you had just sit back and just go with it. Even after seeing the 8 foot wide straight as an arrow trenches, I had to accept that this was going to be something that was purely fictional...then I found out it was a fictional story.

Opening cavalry charge cool to see. I agree with everything Adam posted above, but as we all know...these movies are made for the masses and not us. I was just stoked to see all the early war stuff. I did notice the correct pre/early war yellow piping on the troops! Nice touch that cold have easily been ignored.

Obviously they had to mass the MG08's for the shot and I knew that as soon as I saw it. I did like the meatgrinder effect of the charging cavalry transforming to riderless horses. It was definitely the "old" and "new" worlds of combat meeting each other. Nice artistic touch.

I couldn't help but laugh a bit when they chose the Germans to be the ones to shoot the horses and the young deserters. My wife turned to me before I could even say anything and noted that fact and I told her...have to remember who made this movie. Spielberg will always portray the Germans in the bad light. Nevermind that all the Armies of the time shot deserters and could have had the Germans or French or anybody do that scene. It's to be expected.

I liked it...it was exactly what I thought it would be. Favorite quote of the movie:

"That is the face of my Kaiser..and he doesn't look very happy with me.."-German soldier helping Brit cut Joey from the wire (another "yeah right" moment, but who cares)

[joesweeney]

I thought I would add my 2 cents--particulary on the British part.

The movie was pretty good-not great.

There was an obvious attempt to get uniforming right.

The British Yeomanry Serjeant with Rough Rider proficiency badge and Territorial Force Proficiency Stars was a nice touch. Particularly nice since he was sourcing horse supplies.

The charge was nice and I liked the organization kept going forward.

Just to be clear not all British mounted units had Lances in 1914--only Lancer units--the rest no Lances so swords only was very accurate.

The tank scene did not bother me either (I am a tanker) and was very plausable from the perspective of being alone. Tanks out running supports was very common in 1918(especially amongst the Whippet equipped battalions at Amiens) is till very common even amongst the best trained-I practically live at Ft. Bliss most of the year--happens all the time in training with the 2/1AD and happened to me several times for real 20 years ago. FYI Support out running tanks is also common depending on circumstances.

Even the fact he was in a trench did not bother me. The Hindenburg Line was famous for deep wide Comms trenches.

The only thing I would have changed was with a tank stuck in a trench line those Lewis guns would have been Red Hot under those jackets. The crew inside would have been paniced, spraying bullets every where until they got out. Getting a tank out of a dicth like that is not easy and loosing a track very easy. Although I doubt that the director was actually trying to convey the previuos scenario.

Also the use of the Armor vest by the British Officer was actually a good representation of Trench Armor and very plausable.

There were plenty of WTF moments--The Somme 1918 part I think was more inspired by Flanders 1917 at it's wettest German 21cm Howizter posted on the most prominentexposed hill etc. but those are just theatrical visual points the director wanted to use.

Best seen on big screen and not DVD and remember the movie is actualy about a horse and WWI is only part of the background.

Joe Sweeney

[soldataltengarde]

As mentioned before, fairly accurate uniforms, etc..
But the story line, for 10 year olds!
The worse part: Germans & French speaking English!
I can't stand that!
Once that happened, I knew the rest of the movie was geared toward lazy American audiences who don"t want to be bothered with subtitles.
Spielberg could have done better...

[kingkaiser]

According to Amazon.com, release of War Horse on Blue-ray/DVD is scheduled for April 3, 2012.